Caleb Pearson’s listing presentation system after losing 200 listings without one

Caleb Pearson00:00

So there’s a process. You call and you confirm the appointment the day of or the day before, go through all the pre-qualification questions, make sure that it’s gonna be a good appointment, all the decision-makers are there, see how much they owe on the house, what happened last time, what didn’t work, what were they not happy with, what they’re looking for in an agent.

00:18Go over, meet with the people, and sit down in the living room, or sit down at the kitchen table, not the living room, and actually go through a full presentation. And I do the same thing for every one of my listings, whether it’s a $100,000 listing or a $4 million listing. It’s the same presentation. And it’s just a system and process that I know that works.

00:38I lost 200 listings probably in my career by just beating my head against the wall before I learned a process that works, and we just don’t lose that many anymore. Knock on wood.

Aaron Wittenstein00:55

What’s going on everybody? It’s me, it’s Aaron Wittenstein, and we’re here with Vulcan 7. This is where we talk to agents across the country in regards to taking an additional two, three, four, five, six, seven, eight, nine, 10 listings a week. All right? And this guy sold like 300, 400 expireds and for sale by owners over his career.

01:30Caleb Pearson out of Charleston, South Carolina. Yeah. Not North Carolina as I thought for a second over there, right?

01:38How you doing? How you doing, man?

Caleb Pearson01:39

I’m doing great. Man, I love your energy.

Aaron Wittenstein01:42

I appreciate that. I fake it, I fake it well. That’s because I’ve had 37 cups of coffee today, so.

Caleb Pearson01:49

Hey, same. Same.

Aaron Wittenstein01:51

So from the conversation that we had, you have a lot of experience with expireds and FSBOs, right? Tell me a little bit about that.

Caleb Pearson02:03

Yeah. So I got in the business 14 years ago-ish. No, more like 12 or 13 years ago, and I moved to Charleston from Virginia Beach.

02:12Didn’t know anybody, so I didn’t have a sphere personally. I didn’t have any friends, family that I could get ramped up with. I really didn’t know the area. But someone that worked at Keller Williams, I’m currently at RE/MAX now, but someone that worked at Keller Williams said, “Hey, if you wanna get started, here’s the first place to start.

02:30For sale by owners and expired listings have already said they wanna sell, call these guys.” And then I listened to every podcast, every training call, I went to every seminar. So I mean, I got as good as I possibly could in calling for sale by owners and expireds, and I just hammered ’em.

Aaron Wittenstein02:48

So when you were calling them, like I said, because it’s been a bit because you’ve transitioned your business now from calling the expireds and the for sale by owners

02:56a lot more towards more of a referral. But you still have a team that’s doing it, so you’re training them. But how can I put this? So when you were calling it was maybe a little bit of a different animal, if you will. Did you have like a system in place that you would call, be like, “Call this one at this time, this one at this time,” so on and so forth?

Caleb Pearson03:16

I mean, I called them all day long. I didn’t really have any other leads to call. So I’d start at 8:00 AM and call the newest ones first, and then I’d call yesterday’s right after that, and then they’d just stack up over time, and I was relentless. Like, if anybody told me… Actually, I didn’t even care if they told me no, I would still follow up with them.

03:33So unless they told me they were gonna call and make a complaint to the board, I pretty much called them consistently once a week if I knew that the numbers were right, and just kept following up until they relisted. Because I don’t care what anybody tells you, I would say 60 to 70% of people that list and expire end up putting the house back on the market.

03:55Maybe higher than that.

Aaron Wittenstein03:56

Yeah, true. And so what did you enjoy more? I shouldn’t say enjoy, right? I don’t know if we thoroughly enjoy calling stuff. It’s fun for me, I’m crazy. But were you more of an expired guy or a FSBO guy, or did it really not matter?

Caleb Pearson04:10

It didn’t really matter. I mean, it’s kinda like riding a bike. Once you get it and you learn what works, you just do the same thing over and over and over again. Like I haven’t done it in years, but when I get into training a new guy here at the office, I can hop on and make 10 calls to FSBOs and set a few appointments.

04:28Because what they told me seven years ago, they give you the same objections today. Nothing’s really changed.

Aaron Wittenstein04:35

That’s true. What do you get, like five to seven objections that you hear, pretty much?

Caleb Pearson04:39

They’re the same. They’re the same objections. And I think the biggest thing is to just not tell people they’re wrong and not argue with them and tell them, “Hey, you may be able to sell it on your own.

04:50Hey, your agent may be able to get it sold, but all I wanna do is give you a second opinion. When can I come over there and see if I can help?”

Aaron Wittenstein04:58

Okay. I don’t wanna gloss over it, what you just said at all. Because the thing is, is that you never tell anybody they’re wrong.

05:05You know, you never tell anybody you’re wrong.

05:07Right. Exactly. No, but it’s… What is it? How to Win Friends and Influence People, I believe, is where I first heard that. Can you just expand on that a little bit? Because I think it’s super important.

Caleb Pearson05:19

Yeah, because people tell you, “Hey, I’ll pay you 1% if you bring us a buyer,” or, “We’re not paying a buyer’s agent,” or, “We’ve sold houses on our own in the past.”

05:29They’ll tell you all those things. And as soon as you tell them, “Well, you’re not gonna be able to sell it that way. You need to pay 3%,” or, “You need an agent. You got lucky last time,” like you’re dead to that person. So all you can really do is just encourage them and say, “Hey, you may be right.”

05:43And, “Hey, you want a job? Because if you can sell your home on your own, we’re looking for agents, looking for people that can get houses sold. Come work for me. But let me at least come by there, give you a second opinion. You don’t have to hire me. There’s no obligation.” Pretty much I just pull back and put no pressure on, and I wiggle my way into the living room, and then the listing presentation takes care of itself.

Aaron Wittenstein06:03

So what you’re saying is you don’t argue. I mean, and this goes with, I think, anything in life, right? I always say, if the client says, “The sky is pink and yellow,” what color is the sky? It’s what?

Caleb Pearson06:16

Pink and yellow.

Aaron Wittenstein06:16

Yeah.

06:19Other than my wife, it works very, very well not arguing with anybody.

Caleb Pearson06:24

When you push, people push back. But when you pull and act like you’re not putting any pressure on them, a lot of times you’ll see the conversation turn and it’s like they start pulling you in their direction, and before you know it, you’re sitting in the living room with them.

06:39And then you still have to have a good listing presentation. If you’re just going over there and winging it, you may get 25 to 30% of the appointments you go on. But if you’ve got a systematic listing presentation that’s good, you should win lots of FSBOs and expireds.

Aaron Wittenstein06:56

Okay. So I’m assuming yours is very well on point with what you have.

07:02We don’t have time to go through the whole listing presentation here. Yet what areas need to fill to be able to succeed at that level?

Caleb Pearson07:13

So there’s a process. So it’s like you set the appointment, and then you get their email, send them a Google Calendar invite, send them a pre-listing appointment packet via email.

07:24That’s just like a credibility kit. Because if you’re just setting an appointment and blindly going over there, they don’t know you from Adam when you come through the door. But if you’ve got a good credibility kit or a good website, or just something that makes you look like a professional and stand out from the competition, you’re a step ahead before you even get in the living room.

07:42And then when you get… Well, let me back up one more time. Then you call and you confirm the appointment the day of or the day before, go through all the pre-qualification questions, make sure that it’s gonna be a good appointment, all the decision-makers are there, see how much they owe on the house, what happened last time, what didn’t work, what were they not happy with, what they’re looking for in an agent.

08:01Go over, meet with the people, and sit down in the living room, or sit down at the kitchen table, not the living room, and actually go through a full presentation. And I do the same thing for every one of my listings, whether it’s a $100,000 listing or a $4 million listing. It’s the same presentation. And it’s just a system and process that I know that works.

08:21I lost 200 listings probably in my career by just beating my head against the wall before I learned a process that works, and we just don’t lose that many anymore. Knock on wood.

Aaron Wittenstein08:30

So all right. So you’re doing the listing presentation, all right? And I would assume, like I know what mine looks like.

08:36You know, there’s certain points that I gotta hit. You know what I mean? Like, you go in there, you build rapport. You find out what happened, what their hopes, dreams, goals, and wants, the who, what, why, the where, the when, and the how. All right? Then you go in there, you do marketing, price, and you close.

08:54You know what I mean? So that’s what I found works well. I mean, what does yours look like?

Caleb Pearson09:00

Pretty much the same thing. It’s build rapport, go through marketing, who we are, what we do, why we do it, how we do it. You try to ask the questions like, “Have you interviewed anybody else?

09:10Has anybody said anything to knock your socks off? Anybody said anything you didn’t like?” That way you’re uncovering the objections on the front end or what their selling points are. And then I always talk price last, because if you talk price first and they disagree with your price, you just shot yourself in the foot before you even got started.

09:29Price and commission always go last. You tell them that you charge 6, 7% on the start, nothing you say to them going forward matters if they disagree with you.

Aaron Wittenstein09:39

All right. So let me ask you, would you be game for a quick role play? Is that cool?

Caleb Pearson09:46

Sure.

Aaron Wittenstein09:47

All right. So we’re at the appointment, we’re at the point where you’re gonna close me.

09:51So first, would you mind closing me, please?

Caleb Pearson09:53

Yeah. So I like to go through, I say, “All right, Aaron, after everything I’ve gone over and shown you marketing-wise, do you see why we sell the amount of homes we sell, and do you see why we’re the number one RE/MAX team in the state six years in a row?”

Aaron Wittenstein10:05

I do. You guys really seem to have your stuff together.

Caleb Pearson10:09

Yeah. Is there anything that anybody else showed you that knocked your socks off or blew you away?

Aaron Wittenstein10:15

Well, I mean, we met with Sally Smith Realty, you know? And their social media is really, really strong. They’re all over the interweb. You know what I mean?

10:26But I mean, like I said, you guys look pretty good.

Caleb Pearson10:29

All right. So what did Sally show you that you like so much about their social media?

Aaron Wittenstein10:33

Oh, their Facebook page was gorgeous.

Caleb Pearson10:35

Got it. Are they doing like paid ads or what about it?

Aaron Wittenstein10:38

Oh, I don’t know. It just looked really nice.

Caleb Pearson10:40

Okay. So let me back out, back off, but that’s what I would be doing is, okay, I didn’t hit social media hard enough, so let me flip back to the marketing page and dig in on social media more.

10:51Right?

Aaron Wittenstein10:52

Got it. Okay. Oh, got it. Got it. Okay, I understand now what you’re talking about.

Caleb Pearson10:56

That’s what I’m gonna do because I knew that’s a selling point for you, but I didn’t hit it hard enough because you already brought up that Sally obviously does a better job with social media than we do.

11:08But if you said, “Yeah, I see why,” I say, “All right. Is there anything that anybody said that you didn’t like?”

Aaron Wittenstein11:16

Oh, man. I mean, we had agent one, their price was off. Agent two, I gotta tell you, I just didn’t like him. I just didn’t like agent two. And then we got Sally.

11:26Like I said, you and Sally seem pretty good.

Caleb Pearson11:29

Okay. Yeah. And what price did that agent tell you that you didn’t like?

Aaron Wittenstein11:32

Oh, they were like $100,000 below where you guys are.

Caleb Pearson11:39

Got it. Okay. Well, we haven’t even talked price yet, so we’ll get there. Yeah, but what price did they give you?

Aaron Wittenstein11:46

$400.

Caleb Pearson11:47

$400? Yeah, cheap house. Yeah, so what I’m doing is I’m trying to uncover the selling points before I go for the close. And then I ask, “All right, Aaron, seeing what we’ve done and what we do marketing-wise, is there anything other than price and commission that would keep you guys from doing business with me today?”

Aaron Wittenstein12:05

Well, I mean, I wanna sleep on it. You know what I mean? I wanna think about it, go over everything, to be processed and really just think about it.

Caleb Pearson12:15

Okay. And I’m the last one to go, right? I’m the last one you’re interviewing?

Aaron Wittenstein12:19

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Caleb Pearson12:19

Okay.

12:20Totally understand. I get this comment all the time. But what better time is there to make a decision, Aaron, than when I’m right here to answer all your questions?

Aaron Wittenstein12:28

Okay. I mean, like I said, I understand. It’s just, we were there before, you know. Like I said,

12:38we came off the market, and I just wanna make sure that we’re making the right decision.

Caleb Pearson12:42

Got it. Totally understand. Well, is there anything that I missed that would give you reservations about working with me?

Aaron Wittenstein12:48

No. No, I think you guys did a really nice job.

Caleb Pearson12:51

Okay. All right, I’m gonna try to tie you down pretty hard to be making a decision today, and I’m gonna ask you, Aaron, before I even go on the listing appointment, when I do my pre-call, I’m gonna call and say, “All right, if everything makes sense and you feel comfortable with what we do marketing-wise, price, and commission, are you ready to put me to work tomorrow?”

13:08I’m gonna ask those questions before I go, and that way if you say yes, I know I can get you to make a decision today. If you say, “No, I’m gonna think on it,” I know I’ve got more of an uphill battle to get you to that point where you’re ready to hire me. Right?

13:26Yeah. That’s me talking to you as an interviewer, not as a client.

Aaron Wittenstein13:30

Got it. Yeah, that’s exactly what I thought. So, do we make a decision? I mean, if everything makes sense, I think we would. I think we would.

Caleb Pearson13:41

Okay. And then I’ll go through, if I get that commitment from you there, then I’ll go through price and commission, and then at the end, I let them choose price.

13:50One thing you can do with a FSBO or an expired is you tell them a price that they disagree with and they do not hire you. As soon as you tell them a price that they don’t like, you’re dead to them. So I show them all the numbers and then I’ll say, “All right, Aaron, based on this, where do you think the house needs to be priced?”

Aaron Wittenstein14:11

I would say, like, 500, 525 is probably where we need to be.

Caleb Pearson14:19

Okay. Yeah. And the way that I show these sellers the numbers, it’s so good that very rarely will they be like, “Okay, I need to overprice it.” Usually they’ll see all the numbers and they’ll look at these houses and they’ll say, “All right, I think we need to be within a range.”

14:36And if I know it’s a little high, I’ll say, “Look, Aaron, we can start there, but I highly encourage you, if we’re not getting a lot of showings early and not getting offers, that we need to adjust quickly rather than let it sit on the market for a long time.” So I’m taking the listing, but I’m already prefacing a price reduction before I take it.

14:55Does that make sense?

Aaron Wittenstein14:57

100%.

Caleb Pearson14:57

Yeah. So that’s kind of how I do it, and then at the end I stick my hand out and I say, “All right, you ready to put me to work, Aaron?” And it makes for a really awkward question, and then I just shut up.

Aaron Wittenstein15:08

So all right, so let me ask you this then. So you want the appointment.

15:11You do everything.

15:11You say… Like I said, I talk to a lot of agents, I can tell you’re good at what you do. You stick your hand out and you say, “You ready to put me to work?” How often are they, like at what percentage are they saying yes?

Caleb Pearson15:23

Like, if I’ve done everything right from start to finish,

15:27like, never are they saying no. They’re always like, I mean, maybe they’ll look at each other and then reach across the table and say, “All right, we’re ready,” and they’ll shake hands. But most of the time, if I’ve checked all my boxes and asked all my trial closes up to the end, and gotten yeses to the finish line, I’m gonna get a yes at the end.

Aaron Wittenstein15:50

Okay. For those that may not be familiar with the term, what exactly is a trial close?

Caleb Pearson15:55

A trial close is just like the question that I asked you, “If everything makes sense,” or, “After everything I showed you, Aaron, is there anything other than price and commission that would keep us from doing business today?”

16:06That’s a trial close. ‘Cause I know once they say, “There’s nothing that would keep us from doing business,” I can close that door and I can go to price and commission, and those are my last two things that I have to get right with you to get hired. Right?

Aaron Wittenstein16:22

So you’re closing as you progre- I mean, you’re basically getting agreement throughout the entire process.

16:28So when it comes back to them, they’re like, “Well,” you know what I mean? “Mr. and Mrs. Seller, I’m confused. You said the marketing was right. You said the pricing was right. You agree on my fee. I don’t get it.”

Caleb Pearson16:43

Yeah. And I’ll tell you, if I do all those things and check all those boxes, and they don’t stick their hand out, I’m losing that listing appointment.

16:51Probably 9 out of 10 times. Very rarely do you get through all those segments and get to the finish line, and if they tell you, “No, we’re not quite ready,” or if they tell you, “We need to sleep on it,” or, “We need to think about it,” very rarely are you actually getting that listing if you leave the living room without a signed contract.

Aaron Wittenstein17:12

No, that makes perfect sense. So let me-

Caleb Pearson17:14

That’s just a nice way for them to push you out of the living room, and they’re done.

Aaron Wittenstein17:20

No, that makes perfect sense. Like I said, I see the same thing. You know what I mean? And it’s walking that line where it’s like being tastefully aggressive is where you need to be, right?

17:33And it seems at least from what you do is you’re extremely competent, you know what I mean, in your process. Because how many times have you… You’ve done it, what, 10 billion times, am I right?

Caleb Pearson17:46

I mean, a listing presentation? Yeah. Probably 5,000 times, if I had to guess.

Aaron Wittenstein17:51

And I’m gonna-

Caleb Pearson17:52

Yeah, somewhere around there, if I had to guess.

Aaron Wittenstein17:55

And I’m gonna assume you pretty much do the same thing every time, right?

Caleb Pearson17:59

Every time. Even with friends and family, I still do the listing presentation.

Aaron Wittenstein18:06

So what you’re saying, and what I’m hearing properly here, is don’t deviate from your process. Correct?

Caleb Pearson18:13

Correct. Soon as you do, you don’t set good expectations, they don’t understand the processes, they beat you up on the commission because you didn’t show enough value, and out the door walks a bunch of money that you should have made.

18:30But if you just do the same thing over and over again, it makes your life a lot easier.

Aaron Wittenstein18:35

100%. And I think what happens, and you’ll agree with me on this, trial close, right? Is that there’s always a way to do things, but when you find what works for yourself, whether it’s on the phone, whether it’s in person, whether it’s meeting with a family member, it’s doing what you do, doing it well, and not trying to get cute, right?

Caleb Pearson19:00

Yes. That’s exactly right. And making sure all the decision makers are there, super important. And I like to go last, if I can.

Aaron Wittenstein19:07

Yeah. So how do you posi- Like, do you position it in a way as to go last, or do you just, like, hope that you’re going last?

Caleb Pearson19:16

No, I always ask. “Are you interviewing anybody else, or have you interviewed anybody else?

19:22Okay, when are those appointments? If it’s okay, can we reschedule to Friday? That way you can see what everybody else does, and then you can compare and contrast what we do versus everybody else. Is that fair?”

Aaron Wittenstein19:33

Trial close.

19:34There we go. See, all right, yeah, no, this is really good. No, this is really…

19:39And now, with where you’re at in business now, how big of a team do you have now?

Caleb Pearson19:46

There’s only six of us.

Aaron Wittenstein19:49

Well, that’s not… Now, are they following your system and processes as well?

Caleb Pearson19:54

Everybody does the same thing. Yeah.

19:59It’s just a process.

Aaron Wittenstein20:00

So what you’re trying to tell me is repetition makes money.

20:03Is that right?

Caleb Pearson20:04

Well, yeah, and I’ll tell you, repetition makes money, but also, you can diagnose why you lost an appointment if you do the same thing over and over again every time. ‘Cause I can usually go back to my guys and they’ll say, “Well, I lost it.” I say, “Well, did you go last?” “No.” “Did you ask this question?”

20:22“Well, no, we skipped that step.” “Okay. You skipped that step and it cost you $30,000 in commission, because they brought up that they had one more person that they were interviewing after you that was already on the schedule, and you didn’t know about it because you didn’t ask them the pre-qual question, were they interviewing anybody else.”

Aaron Wittenstein20:39

That’s good. That’s good. All right. So this is a question that I ask everybody that comes through this wonderful podcast here. You got a new agent, which it sounds like you get quite a few of them. They knock on your door. All right. What’s one piece of advice that you have for that new agent?

Caleb Pearson20:54

Get good coaching. I think that’s the best thing you can do, and the quickest shortcut to success is to get a coach. If you can afford it, I mean, that coach, especially someone that’s done it and been in the business, they can help you shortcut a lot of years and help you from banging your head against the wall, and running a bunch of appointments and getting frustrated, pretty easily.

21:20If you get a good one.

Aaron Wittenstein21:21

Yeah, yeah. You gotta make sure you get the right one, right? Okay. So no, this is really good. You know what I mean? I love what you’re saying about this stuff because we talk a lot about calling and calling and calling here, which is where it all starts.

21:36Yet the thing is, is where it comes to a head is when you’re actually sitting belly to belly with somebody, right?

21:42And it’s nice to see that process, what that looks like. So what final words do you have for our people over here in Vulcan 7 Nation?

Caleb Pearson21:52

Just be persistent.

21:54Persistent, consistent. Just don’t get discouraged because everybody beats their head up against the wall a little bit when they first get started. Learn from your mistakes. But make changes if you make a mistake. And if you lose an appointment, call the people and say, “Hey, I appreciate your time.

22:15Totally understand you’re going with Joe. For my own personal growth, what constructive criticism can you give me? What could I have done differently to have earned your business?” And they’ll usually tell you what the other person did to get their business. And I mean, dig deep and ask questions. Don’t just let them tell you, “You were nice, but we felt a little bit more comfortable with Joe.”

22:38But what was it about Joe? I mean, figure it out.

Aaron Wittenstein22:42

Right. No, that makes perfect sense. That makes perfect sense. So Caleb, if somebody has a referral in your area in Charleston, South Carolina, not North Carolina, how do they get in touch with you, my friend?

Caleb Pearson22:56

They can email me or text me, call me.

23:00My number is 843-609-5590 is my cell. Text is usually the easiest.

Aaron Wittenstein23:07

Beautiful. Beautiful. All right, well thank you very much for being here. Guys and girls, everybody that comes in, we’re gonna have other agents coming in from across the country. Caleb, would you like to do business together? Are you ready to put me to work?

Caleb Pearson23:21

Yes, sir.

Aaron Wittenstein23:21

There we go.

23:22All right, everybody, take care of yourselves. Thank you, Caleb. This was amazing. Thank you very much.

Caleb Pearson23:28

Thanks, man. Appreciate you having me on.

Aaron Wittenstein23:30

Thank you. You’re welcome.